IST Raiding and 25-man Sign-up

[Donalzon]

Aye, I am ready and willing to lead the charge into whatever dungeon the Tribe needs to cleanse.

Donalzon
prot paladin
both nights although periodically missing Fri.

[Eruadan]

Even though I am sure Jaba knows I will attend his raids, and am on his assumption list I will post here.

Eruadan
Priest
Healer (Discipline for Party/Tank healing)
Both nights are fine (wont raid two nights in a row though except on weekends)

[Dentik]

1. Dentik
2. Druid
3. Resto Healer
4. Both

[Guest]

PS Last night was awesome

[Guest]

I was really hope it would work out better, but my current living situation limits my nighttime (after 9PM EST) raiding options. I'm going to have to bow out of Naxx until Mellith and I move, though I'm hoping that, if Monday night raids are short enough, I can attend those.

[Guest]

Now that I've cleared naxx (sans kel but going to work on him tonight and we had him down to15%) if we had enough people I could help out for a second 10 man

[Guest]

I would love to join. I am primarily DPS spec, but I can go tank if we're ever short.

[Guest]

I would like to come on Friday nights, it's the only night that doesn't conflict with my classes.

[Guest]

Availability update: I will be able to raid more starting February 1st, Fridays and Mondays.

[Melikar]

1. Melikar or Kardwel
2. Warrior or Paladin
3. Both are DPS (Arms (willing to respec Fury if need be) and Ret)
4. It really depends on my work schedule. If I know (or at least think) I will be free, I will post in the weekly topics that pertain to interest on raids.

[Guest]

Right now I'm sitting here realizing we don't have consistent numbers for two 10 mans. Please consider a rotation for every other week/ a one night one thing. second night another thing deal.

The same people have been going and since we obviously don't have the numbers yet I think it'd be fair to rotate people out so all of us get a shot. It probably doesn't mean much to those of you who are getting to go, but us "leftovers" are feeling left out

[Melikar]

Right now I'm sitting here realizing we don't have consistent numbers for two 10 mans. Please consider a rotation for every other week/ a one night one thing. second night another thing deal.

The same people have been going and since we obviously don't have the numbers yet I think it'd be fair to rotate people out so all of us get a shot

I agree 110%

I also notice that the same group of people tend to get in these raids while the rest of us "leftovers" are just stuck to forming whatever we can scrap together. It's the same way with Heroics in this guild, at least by what I have seen.

Very rarely, do I ever get a successful group to go do Heroics with. I prefer not to use the LFG channel simply because of bad experiences before. But there are *certain people* who get groups together in IST no problem. I'm not going to say names, but judging by gear and stats, it isn't too hard to figure out. I have been doing more raiding and dungeons with other guilds than my own. Please tell me I'm not the only one who sees this.

This is not just your tribe, it is mine as well as everyone else's and we all need to share what we can. I showed an hour early for the latest Naxx raid only to be told I wasn't going two hours later. It doesn't matter if one person is singularly responsible for setting up a second raid or not, it needs to be communicated and coordinated by other raid leaders as well. I remember showing up early for Kara on Mel all the time pre-Lich and would be told that I wasn't getting in after waiting some time and talking to said raid leader about it. What I'm trying to say is, this is the same stuff happening all over again.

Sorry if I offended anyone, but this is my honest opinion. I would rather say it now then explode at everyone and end up leaving the guild later.

EDIT: Discussion for this can be found here.

[Shillatae]

Three things here.

First, these posts were inappropriate in this thread. I'll address your posts here as I can't see a command for me to split this into a new thread however.

Second, this is waaaay premature. Tonight was the second time we entered Naxxramas and killed anything. Last Friday was the first time we entered Naxxramas and killed anything. We know there aren't enough people ready or available for 25-man yet and knew there was a possibility that a second ten might not get off the ground immediately. Donalzon quite impressively put together a group last week but only two or so were Tribe. Without his presence and enough people to make the second group work there was little else to be done.

Finally, we certainly will make rotations and other official plans. So far we had a couple of scouting runs neither of which ended in any boss kills at all and last week our first kills on some bosses. We took officers for the first runs so that on future runs whichever of us are available on any given week will know as many fights as possible. Tonight we went in again without Jabadue, the usual raid leader, to see how we would do. It went well. Now we can plan going forward.

Melikar, your angry comments going back to TBC and suggesting that you are being excluded intentionally in favor of others I will certainly not hold against you. I'm quite sure you did more content than myself in TBC though, and I empathize because I was unable to get to do many things I had hoped in that expansion. The reality is none of us are always able to get what we want done, regardless of guild rank or perception. If you happen to log in - as I have - and see that most people on are already in instances it can be disheartening, though.

However it is disrespectful of you both to imply that we don't all experience this. I've banged my head on my desk in frustration at not being able to "gel" a group countless times as Kosath will attest. Hell, we live together and have time conflicts with each other constantly, let alone with finding more to join us online! I've gotten well over my head trying to learn tanking on the fly with patient Tribemates I hadn't often grouped with in the past. I'm genuinely sorry you haven't been one of them. Though you'd probably be a better tank! : )

Thanuist, your recommendations were sound and along the lines of what we would like to do. I wish you hadn't felt the need to append sniping comments to them about how inclusivity doesn't mean anything to your officers and raid leaders but I include them with Melikar's remarks and empathize with where you are coming from.

Tribe, you really should understand that Ironsong would have progressed much farther through raid content in every expansion and phase of the game if we didn't care about inclusivity as much as we did. We took well over 100 people through the Molten Core but never penetrated Blackwing Lair. We took dozens of people into Karazhan but only defeated Kael'thas as TBC wound to a close. Including people in our runs is what we have always been all about. Everyone can't go every time by any means and I sat out of Zul'gurub or Karazhan my fair share. Heck, I never fought the end bosses of Kara. Regardless of whether it progressed the Tribe, we've always taken as many people as possible wherever we could go.

I respect both of you needing to vent your frustrations about tonight. Please consider our code of conduct and treat your Tribemates with more respect as well. You both say some uncharitable things that I have taken as charitably as possible I think. Given this is our second week of killing anything in Naxxramas with an Ironsong run your level of heat on the issue is a bit extreme. The issue of finding 5-man groups and heroics is a separate and distinct one that might be good to address individually. If Tuesday night instancing is not a useful option for you perhaps you or we should consider adding something else? I know I've had a few nights where I sit online doing little save perhaps dailies or old world soloing.

I encourage anyone interested to start a NEW thread addressing any of these issues constructively. Otherwise, any further off-topic posts in this thread will be deleted. Feel free to use the usual officer contact methods if you want to discuss this more on a one on one basis as well. In-game chat or mail, forum mail on this site or the officer contact mail we have posted on the site.

Be part of a solution,
Shillatae / Kuskuh

[Efluvious]

I think a bit of the frustration comes from the lack of transparency in ordering the group. That has been my frustration in the past in both joining a group (or being one of the ones that had to be left out) and in leading a group where I had to say "We have 12 wanting to go and can only take 10. Who's willing to step out this week?"

Sorry for continuing this off-topic discussion, just trying to be helpful.

[Guest]

1. Umu
2. Warrior
3. DPS (can spec to offtank if needed but DPS prefered)
4. Mon or Fri!